Turkish jets chase Israeli plane over Cyprus – reports

May 19, 2012 | Filed under: Geopolitics

TURKEY accused Israel on Thursday of violating the airspace of Turkish-occupied northern Cyprus in a controversial oil and gas exploration area.

The Israeli aircraft “violated” the northern Cyprus’s airspace five times in Monday’s incident which saw Turkish fighter jets chase out the intruder, the army command said in a statement.

The airspace violations reportedly occured between 11:05 a.m. and 12:49 p. m., and lasted a total of eigth minutes.

It gave no other details about the incident nor the type of Israeli plane involved in the alleged incursion over the breakaway statelet, which is recognized only by Ankara.

Reports suggest that since Monday, extra air patrols from the Lefkoniko (Gecitkale) airbase are being conducted over the occupied areas. Lefkoniko is the main airfield of the Turkish Cypriot Security Force and is also used by Turkish Army Aviation.

Turkey’s relations with Israel have soured since Israeli commandos in 2010 stormed a Turkish ship carrying activists trying to break the Israeli blockade of Gaza, killing nine Turks.

GAS SHIP

Last September, low-flying Israeli warplanes and helicopters “harassed” a Turkish ship exploring for natural gas reserves near Cyprus, according to Turkish media reports.

Today’s Zaman reported that two F-15 jets took off from Tel Aviv and flew through the airspace of both The Republic of Cyprus and Turkish-controlled northern Cyprus. The jets reportedly ignored warnings from officials of Turkish Cyprus.

BASE

In March the Turkish Cypriot leader Dervis Eroglu said he convinced that Cyprus and Israel are discussing setting up an Israeli military base near Paphos, despite the fact that both sides deny reports on the issue.

Eroglu also said that Israel was now being used as a ‘tool’ in the ongoing Cyprus dispute and any moves to station military aircraft in Cyprus would only serve to exacerbate tensions in the region.

Rumours that Israel had requested use of the base have been circulating for several months, and the request is understood to have been discussed at a meeting between the Cypriot Minister of Defence and his Israeli counterpart.

Source: famagusta-gazette.com

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Makos

This is the other side of the coin. What Turkey does to Greece now Israel does it to Turkey.
Israel is essentially stating: this is our backyard now!

Tyroneez

At makos above
Exactly correct , last year turkey thought it was opening up a treasure trove for itself , in Cypriot EEZ …
Instead all it did was open up a Pandoras box of troubles …
Well whats the saying ?
“sooner or later , what goes around , comes around”

http://www.facebook.com/Phoevos Dean Plassaras

This is probably a dry run by the Israelis to show how in the future Greek and Israeli F-15s will begin to patrol the area.
Emre

They must be crazy!? If our planes flew over Israeli waters/territory, they would drop our plans down. Erdogan should stand by his words! Drop the planes down and see if they ever fly over…Oh and ofcourse it will be SELF DEFENCE just like the Israeli comandos did.

Harris Samaras

The fact is that the Israeli planes did not fly within Turkish airspace. Self defence is the lawful right of every sovereign when their space (and other) is violated. If Turkish planes were flying within Cyprus airspace without the permission of the Republic of Cyprus it was Turkey that violated international law.

Emre

We do not recognize Republic of Cyprus as a whole. It doesn’t exist such a thing for Turkey. There are 2 countries in Cyprus…KKTC and South Cyprus.
South Cyprus or so called Republic of Cyprus doesn’t represent the people living on the otherside.
KKTC has its own laws, legislation, parlament.
Look at the map, do you think that Cyprus has anything to do with Europe continent? Why do you think EU accepted a disputed island to its borders as a whole? EU ain’t stupid. After the find of gas, EU wanted to claim the island and it did. For me it is a total charade (clown-style diplomacy) by EU. So Turkey is invading a part of EU and EU lets it? What kind of union is EU to let a part of its land occupied? It loses recpect. And we need to solve the Cyprus problem to enter to EU? With all respect, EU can go to hell! Like it or not, fair or not, there was the UN plan to reunite the island and it was rejected and NOT by Turkish Cypriots. And Turkey with Turkish Cypriots have to pay the price? No thank you.
Kibris is a highly strategic island in Meditarranean, Turkey won’t, shouldn’t, wouldn’t give it away without guaranteing the rights of her citizens. Ok, we invaded it after GC’s gave the reason for us to do so and you gave us another reason to fight for it even more after the rejection of Annan plan. And now with the gas situation, Turkey is crazy to leave it just like that. It passed from strategical to economical. Sorry to say this but South Cyprus has lost the opportunity to unite the island so be it…

Harris Samaras

Mr. Emre:

1. People and countries earn the right to belong to the free world when they abide to international law and respect the rights of their citizens and their neighbors. Turkey fulfils neither of the above criteria…
2. The only country that recognizes occupied Cyprus is Turkey… the rest of the world is wrong…
3. A map not recognized by international community and the UN is not a valid map. There are other illegal boundaries drawn on maps, maps of so-called states created unlawfully that have no validity or legitimacy, the occupied area by Turkey in Cyprus is one of them.
4. The Annan Plan was a UN inspired proposal (with the support of powerful lobbies). The legitimate citizens of Cyprus replied a powerful NO to injustice and to a plan that would be unviable. Plans that are based on injustice have a very short life…
5. Turkish-Cypriots are not Turkish citizens.
6. Turkish-Citizens are more than guaranteed their human rights as each and every citizen of the Republic of Cyprus is, as all the other minorities citizens of Cyprus are. Without being sarcastic, it is quite an oxymoron when a Turk speaks of human rights…
7. As per your, “…Turkish-Cypriots have to pay the price…” simply, the thief, has limited rights in a civilized world. Turkish-Cypriots have a choice and I am sure if their life was not dictated by Turkey’s expansionist policy they would have made the right one.

I close by saying that the civilized world and the neighbors of Turkey look forward to a Turkey that respects human rights and abides to international law. There is plenty in this corner of the world for everybody… And this corner of the world does not belong only to Turkey…

Emre

1. Turkey had to intervene with Cyprus as Turkey is a guarantor country. The reason we are in Cyprus is because the rights of our citizens weren’t respected. South Cyprus GC gangs acts against TC civilians…
2. We defended our citizens future in the island.
3. Ok
4. We all lost the chance to reunite the island. If KKTC is not recognized etc why decide this in a UN vote?
5. So? We have lots of citizens in KKTC
6. South Cyprus has failed several times to show that guarantee.
7. We are no thief to defend our citizens. TC’s have already made their decision in the UN vote showing their ambition to solve the problem. I can’t tell the same for GC.
I close by saying that Turkey is forced to continue defend its strategical, economical and social interests. We are being forced to go radical in this highly threatening environment. We have Greece waiting for the slightest chance, we have South Cyprus-Israel axis threatening us everyday. We have Syria, Armenia threat. We have problems with Iraq and Iran you might never know.
If international law was to be followed all around the world, it was probably a peaceful situation. Do not expect us to do that when there is double standard in the region and that the so called international law applies only to some countries.
So the dead-lock continues. The charade continues and peace and a common solution is harder to reach everyday. Do not expect ever to Turkey in this lifetime or the other to simply give up of its legal rights and its citizens rights just like that.
Harris Samaras

You describe a country, Turkey, as a country that must abide to Machiavellianism, Cynicism, Egotism, Bullying and Jingoism to “defend” itself from Armenians, Greeks and Syrians. Armenians, Greeks and Syrians who have been massacred by Turkey and their properties have been stolen to say the least… Iranians are Turkey’s best friends, they are not a threat… and when you speak of Iraq you mean the Kurdistan part of Iraq… the Kurds that Turkey massacred, enslaved, and violated their human rights and still does until today… So you must naturally expect that all these people of all these nations that Turkey repeatedly violated and still violates their human rights must remain friends with Turkey… And despite the injustice that Turkey caused upon them, there should be more injustice by Turkey no matter what! Don’t you think that Turkey brought it on itself (to be surrounded by enemy countries)? Don’t you think that Turkey as the invader and conqueror should finally reason and offer a true hand of peace?

The Cyprus-Israel “axis” is not a threat to Turkey but I understand why you see this “axis” as a threat: The exploitation of the hydrocarbons within their EEZs is a sovereign right of theirs and as you stated international law is something that Turkey can live without. Also, Israel is a formidable military force… a major headache for Turkey’s expansionist policies…

Mr. Emre, I am Cypriot but I do not hate Turks despite all the pain that Turkey has caused to us. I am mature enough to realize that neighbors must learn to respect each other and get along; otherwise chaos will dictate the lives of all of us. The only way to achieve this is by abiding to international law, not partially and whenever it suits us but wholly. I have children and I want them to have a future Mr. Emre, don’t you want your children to have a future too? I do, I want your children to have a future Mr. Emre!
Tyroneez

@emre
If you really believe that Cyprus or greece for that matter is a threat to turkey , then you are more delusional than I ever suspected ..
Cyprus and Greece , don’t want to attack turkey , what would be the point …
We don’t want to see the turkish air force and navy destroyed by the Israelis …with all those innocent young Turkish boys lost …because of their governments enormous EGO …
All we want is for turkey to back off and give us some peace ..
Clearly your government has gone too far this time …
Surely if must be obvious Even to you , the Americans have given the Israelis the signal … To put turkey back in it’s place …which the waters south of Cyprus , clearly is not considered by anybody (except the Turkish government) to be it
We also want turkey to come to a just settlement on Cyprus …and stop trying by sheer force to brush aside the rights if 82% of the population
And turn the country Into a Turkish majority state …
We want you to be like Italy … Which no longer threatens us , with occupation or even hegemony … But treats us as equal partners … Despite it’s six times larger population …
You even proposed exactly what the Cyprus government proposes as a solution … Turkish military withdrawal and Turkish Cypriot return to the republics government and institutions …
But mr eroglou … Seems to have other ideas ??
I suggest you and your fellow citizens , speak to your leaders next time you are at the ballot box … Before they land you in a bigger catastrophe than that murderous bunch did , back in 1914

Tyroneez

@emre above
Again your missing the whole point …
Yes as you say Cyprus is the most strategic place in the meditteranean …
And because of this …. None of the powers will allow , any of it’s rivals to control the country …
Britain and Greece has accepted this long ago …
Turkey just cannot see it …
trying to (incorporate/annexe) cyprus by stealth …Will only lead to major clashes ….
First of all its unjust and against the wishes of the vast majority of Cypriots (Christians and Moslems) …
But it also clashes with other major powers interests …
Which is why it was deemed preferable , for the country to be independent and non-aligned …
It’s suits everyones strategic interests …
The Russians
The USA
The Europeans
Greece
Israel
The Arabs
And turkey
Which is why Turkey should be supporting THE REPUBLIC OF CYPRUS … Not trying to destroy it !!!
Now israel is forced to push turkey out of Cyprus … Not for the sake of the Cypriots … But for israels own strategic reasons ..
So long as turkey keeped to the northern area , it’s illegal occupation was somewhat tolerated by the western powers …
But now that turkey has finally taken the step of trying to directly control the destiny of the WHOLE country …(which has been the fear of the Cypriots all along) …
Tyrkey has stired the hornets nest of problems for itself …
Turkey still doesn’t get it …
The other powers can never allow any country to totally control Cyprus …
Because with Cyprus comes control of the whole eastern meditteranean ….

Eric R.

“If our planes flew over Israeli waters/territory, they would drop our plans down. Erdogan should stand by his words! Drop the planes down and see if they ever fly over…”

Emre, that statement implies that Israel flew over Turkish air space. It did not. It flew over the space of a so-called “country” that only Turkey recognizes and nobody else.

Emre

Everyone knows that Israel is provoking Turkey. Turkey should drop down these jets immediately before it becomes a habit! Erdogan is idiot and loses respect if he doesn’t order this action. And then we will see whose airspace it is.

Eric R.

“Everyone knows that Israel is provoking Turkey”

Sure, because with Iran building nuclear weapons with the aim of exterminating the Jews, Syria in a civil war, Heabollah aiming 50,000 rockets at it, and the Islamonazi savages of the Muslim Brotherhood taking over Egypt, Israel has nothing better to do than provoke Turkey.

Got it.

Any other brilliant ideas, Sultan?

Emre

Heh, that is the best explanation that you can give? This comment of yours shows how sick your brain is. Israel really needs to be taught a lesson. If Israel hasn’t anything better than to provoke Turkey then when your jets start dropping from the skies, don’t cry.
Eric R.

lf Emre:

Try “teching Israel a lesson” and you will be burying 40 million dead Turks – well, actually less, since a lot of those 40 million will have been vaporized.
Emre

Go back to Israel and speak for themselved then to showing off from US where you peacefully sit! The day that happens, there isn’t a country called Israel anymore.
Eric R.

If anything, Israel is way too nice to those filthy savages in Gaza. How do I know that?

Because Gaza is still standing.

If Greece were lobbing missiles at your territory, you would have flattened the country in no time.

It is long past time for Israel to do the same. The “people” in Gaza can go flee to their wonderful Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt.

The next time the filthy savages of Hamas lob a missile at Israel, the Israelis should send one missile back.

Only Israel’s should have a 10-kt atomic warhead on it.

Tytoneez

At emre above
But it was the Turkish government that first provoked Israel …
Last September … When they threatened to intercept Israeli naval ships , moving to and from the Israeli gas rigs in Israeli EEZ …
Sending the Turkish navy to bombard the line between the israeli an Cypriot EEZ …
Sending the piri-reis to explore for gas in waters south of Cyprus ??
Which by any stretch of the imagination , are not Turkish or turkish Cypriot waters ??
Sending warplanes to buzz and harass the israeli gas rig ,
Well two can play at that game …
Turkey has got used to threatening and bullying little Cyprus ..Which has no airforce … A very easy target …
But now that the Turkish government has made the BIG MISTAKE of trying to bully a country that has an airforce …and is capable of retaliating …
You are crying … UNFAIR , UNFAIR …
That idiot Erdogan , picked on another small country , thinking it would be as easy as Cyprus …
And looking at the map tiny israel looks minute next to turkey …
But the map lies …
Israel has the most sophisticated airforce in the world …
What was he thinking … ??? DAHHH

Sal

Isn’t that the same case for Israel ? Who recognizes the colonazation of Palestine!

Eric R.

Have the Greeks in Cyprus sworn to exterminate Turkey? Unlike the Palestinians, the Greek Cypriots are not sick, deranged, hate-filled, genocidal Nazi savages.

Emre

Double standard!
1) GC’s EOKA have sworn to exterminate TC before the Peace Operation.
2) Turkey have secured the cities/areas, didn’t continue expanding.
3) Turkey doesn’t have a colonization strategy unlike Israel which continuously does using the religious factores (Hareidis etc).
Eric I don’t know how it is justificable to continously expand and expand and expand and say that it is because you are under threat? The ideia is to occupy all Jordan, Egypt, Palestine, Syria, Iran to finish with the threat?
You can’t justify the unjustifiable.
Eric R.

Listen to your ranting. You’ve been brainwashed by all of Erdogan’s Islamofascist propaganda.

You probably also think that Jews control the world’s banks and news media, that we invented AIDS, that 9-11 was a Mossad plot, and that we take the blood of Muslim children to make Matzoh.

Seriously, there are people in mental hospitals with a greater grip on reality than you.
Emre

From the above blubberish that you speak, only thing that is true is that Jews have a big control over money issues all around the world. You are good traders, it is normal that it is like that.
You still didn’t answer how you justify the continous expansion and colonization…
Give this mental guy a good answer..

Tyroneez

Dear emre
You know very well that the Israeli planes are flying over illegally occupied Nicosia …
If Turkish war planes can fly illegally over Cypriot airspace , then why not Israeli plans ??
And you calling for turkey to shoot down the Israeli planes is beyond idiotic …
Don’t you know that turkey cannot shoot them down , without bringing instant retaliation on the (illegal Turkish airforce base at lefkoniko) if not worse …
To shoot down even one Israeli plan , will mean the total destruction of the Turkish airforce … Even in turkey itself …
…and yes erdogan is a fool for bringing turkey to this situation .. When he sent the Turkish navy to bombard the seas … Right next to the Israeli gas rigs in the Israeli EEZ last September … Your anger should be directed At him , and not the Israelis …
As to your suggestion that the Greek and Turkish Cypriots should get together and agree to split Cyprus 50/50 … And then build a pipeline to pump the gas through turkey …
Is just ludicrous …
The Greek Cypriots made their last concession by accepting a Turkish Cypriot majority area as far back as 1977 …on a generous 25% to 29% of Cypriot territory , in their anxiety to end the Turkish occupation quickly and for people to return to their homes soonest possible …
But denktash refused to even discuss it for 30 long bitter years …Instead stubbornly trying to hang on to 40% and all of it 84% Greek cyoriot owned !!!
The Annan plan was not equitable …and came 40 years too late … Giving all the powers to the 18% turkish Cypriot minority … Not just in the north , but also in the south ??
Of course it would be rejected …
As to the pipeline … Only a moron , cannot see that israel would NOW never agree to ship its gas exports through turkey….
When only weeks ago erdogan was threatening , he would cut off Israeli gas shipments via turkey instantly (if they existed)… ???
I know and believe that you are a genuinely good man … And very concerned about were this whole dangerous dispute is taking all of us …
And your heart is probably in the right place … But your head is all over the place …
Get a grip , and get the facts ..and maybe all this would make more sense to you …

Eric R.

“If Turkish war planes can fly illegally over Cypriot airspace , then why not Israeli plans ??”

Tyrone,

Your question seems to imply that Israeli planes were flying there illegaly. If the Israeli planes were flying there with the knowledge and approval of the government of Cyprus, then your question is not a correct one, because Israeli planes would be flying there legally.

Tyroneez

@Eric above
You are correct of course ….
What I should have said is …
“if Turkish war planes can fly illegally over Cypriot airspace , Then why Can’t israeli war planes fly over cyprus” (legally)
Sometimes my meaning is lost in the haste of my typing …lol
Apologies

Solinariforever

Attaboy Emre,
So should the Geeks do to the Turkish planes flying over Greek islands, right?

What nonsense! Instead the Turks should start thinking about GOOD NEIGHBORHOOD RELATIONS and maybe someday there will be a reversing trend to form a true eastern Med alliance with Turkey in it. All on equal rights – NATO would have survived about less than ten years without this particular right. We do not learn from examples do we?

Emre

Mr Samaras,
I answer here as I have little space down back there…
First of all it is not that simple. Greeks: Massacred several thousands of Turks and burned down villages when their ambition to capture ALL anatolian as the puppet of UK after WW1. Armenians right after WW1 had their ambition as well and massacred Turks and burnt villages. Same goes for Kurds as they tried to gain their independence when we were in WW1. So, it is not that simple as you refer. History of Turkey is full of facts like this. For me all these nations around us have been under Otoman rule for so many years that they can’t accept this fact and hold a very eager anger due to this fact. It is history and hard to forget.
Turkey the conquerer? The evil plans of the West left us Ankara without any access to sea. UK occupied Istanbul, Greece occupied Izmir and Aegean region, North was created the Pontus country, Armenians claimed Kars, Agri, Erzurum region. French occupied Diyarbakir and region, Italy occupied Meditarranean coast. And that we are the conquerer? We had to reconquer what was already ours. Not even Germany was punished this much after WW1.
Ofcourse Israeli-Cyprus-Greece axis is a threat to Turkey. With the backing and provocations of Israel, things will get worser.
As a Turk I don’t hate GC’s ou Greeks or Armenians in general. We are just fed up with constant pressuring by these. As for neighbours, it is very important in Turkey. We have a saying: “Don’t buy a house, buy a neighbour”. My family lives 30+ years with our best neihgbours as armenians. We respect their religion, they respect ours. I have grown up with their kids since I was born. And no, they don’t try to kill us at the middle of the night raiding into our house. Turks, believe or not, are the most friendly, hospital race you can ever find in the world, and also the worst enemy you can arrange when you touch to our pride, our blood. So, as Turkey (you say) have caused lots of pain to you but you forget that you have caused lots of pain to TC’s at the time. I don’t know why you don’t understand that every action has a reaction and that we Turks truly believe that the day GC’s EOKA plundered and raped and killed women and children in TC villages, there was no coming back from that and we had to act. I won’t say that Turkey didn’t have fault in having all these countries as adversaries and enemies because we had errors. Yes Turkey had faults as well because we did the same thing against EOKA attacks and probably we were looking for a reason to recapture Cyprus. Yes we acted wrong against Armenians and Kurds and Syrians. We shouldn’t have let those incidents happen which is a shame for our history.
Let’s now come to today. Yes I would like you and your family to live happily in wherever you like as I wish that for mine. We had this chance with the vote, we lost it. TC side has already showed its intention in the vote, correct?
Now the island is becoming as strategic as never due to hydrocarbon reserves, I do not know what kind of peace hand you are looking for? A peace hand that will abdicate all rights of TC and Turkey? Now there is in play the hydrocarbons and their way back to EU. Now the negotiations will de deadlocked for ever Mr Harris. Turkey would want to guarantee that the gas pass by Turkey, and that TC’s have iqual rights on gas drills and have say to which contractors the drilling will be given. Which South Cyprus won’t and at the moment can’t decide as the big players already shared it. EU doesn’t have the same card they had some 15 years ago (the promise to enter to EU) so they can’t make us do things as we are sick of their policies.
I had here some posts to solve the problem but ofcourse the peace hand that I presented was bitten several times. It is hard to please every side.
TC-GC unite. Turkey pay compensation for dislocated GC’s. GC’s go back to their homes as well as TC’s. Turkey leave troops in yearly basis in a period of 5-10 years time. TC’s and GC’s form shared government. Foreign policy will be very hard (I don’t know exactly how this will work but it can lead Cyprus to chaos in a very short period of time). Turkey and then the joint RC make joint gas drills at North Cyprus. Meanwhile same goes for Greece and Turkey in the Aegean (50/50). This would improve relations for sure.
If the peace hand you would like to see is that Turkey leave all without anything, then there will be no happy future for your kids, for my kids and the region will continue as it is until we drop an Israeli jet.

Tyroneez

@emre above
Why do you persist in distorting everything , you cannot actually believe what you are saying here …
Because if you and your fellow turkish citizens do still believe it , then we are all lost …
1/ the Armenian and Greek and Assyrian , CIVILIAN citizens of the ottoman empire , were robbed , dislocated , massacred in their MILLIONS …all Unarmed Civilian YOUNG AND OLD MEN , YOUNG AND OLD WOMEN , CHILDREN AND THE BABY’S
Between 1914 and 1918 … Long before the authorised GREEK INTERVENTION in Anatolia which only started in 1919 …
All these Christian so called minorities , were actually majorities in there ancestral homelands … These were not ethnically turkish areas …
Just as the Arab majority areas of the 1914 ottoman empire were Not ethnically turkish …
These christian areas had the right to seccede , just as did the arabs …in their majority areas …
The criminal , regime of Enver. Talat and Gemal … Decided to eliminate these Christian peoples , before the War ended , so as to turn their homelands , into Turkish majority territory …
The total ellimination of 5 million Christian civilians is called GENOCIDE …
What is there about this that you do not understand …
Have you no heart , can you not feel , have you no eyes .. To see …that what you are saying is not correct …
The Greek intervention was authorised , precisely because of the massacres of the Armenian , and Greek civilians by their own ottoman government during WWI ..
The greek jntefvention was aughorised With the aim of protecting the majority Greek areas , and the safe return of the 300,000 indeginous greeks who had escaped to the nearby greek islands in 1914 and 1915 …
Also the 6 eastern provinces , were granted to Armenia , so as to re-establish the Armenian majority area that existed before WWI …
In total contrast the 450,000 Muslims of Greece were never targeted , during WWI neither during the Greco turkish war 1919 to 1922 ..
Nobody is saying the Turkish people as a whole were responsible for these crimes against humanity … Either then or now …
But the regime extremist young tutk regime was guilty , in fact the leaders were tried by Turkish courts in 1918 , and found guilty and sentenced to death in absentia … As the cowards had fled to Germany and elsewhere
Dear emre
I have a question for you …
When they told you at school , that the millions of evil Christians were killed by the brave Turkish armed forces , because Greece had invaded …
Did you not ask yourself , but the Greek army did not come until 1919 ?? And the Young Turk regime was condemned at the Versaille peace conference in 1918 , for the mass murder of it’s own Christian civillian populations … 1 year before the greek army was authorised to land at Smyrna …
The peace conference could see that Because no Turkish government could be trusted to safeguard any remaining or returning ottoman Christian citizens …
And of course they were correct in their assessment … The proof is that when the extrrmist nationalists of Kemal eventually took control of these areas , all the surviving Christians were expelled . At the point of the sword …
Did not ask ,Why are the dates all wrong ??…
Why did you not ask , something is not correct with this story , that I’m being told ??
Just because YOU choose to ignore the facts … Does not mean that anybody else will do likewise …
Especially we who know what is TRUTH …

Tyroneez

@emre above
2/ there was no general massacre of Turkish Cypriots in Cyprus
In 1963 the bicommunal government , brokedown , as the Turkish cypriot LEADERSHIP , was deliberately using its veto to block all legislation ..so as to provoke a crisis and facilitate a Turkish invasion …
Everybody knows this …. denktash himself has boasted of this many , many times …
As the government split and law and order brokedown , (just as denktash wanted)…Without any care for the lives of his Turkish Cypriot compatriots , who he says could be sacrificed , for the sake of a greater turkey ..
the paramilitaries committed atrocities on both sides … 650 Turkish Cypriots and 450 Greek Cypriots lost their lives … Before law and order was restored .. By the UN unficyp forces called in by president Makarios …
Why would he call in the UN troops to protect turkish Cypriot enclaves , if the plan was to kill the Turkish Cypriot civilian population ??
The planned and expected Turkish invasion was stopped by the Americans ( because they feared that a general war between Greece and turkey might follow , and cause the breakup of NATO with the loss of Greece or turkey to the soviet side) …
As the Turkish invasion did not come … Denktash found himself , left high and dry …he had everything to gain by starting the troubles …
Wereas the Greek Cypriots leadership did not , the last thing they would have done was to provoke a Turkish invasion …??
For you to simply say that the Greeks , just started to attack the Turks … Is absurd …
And has nothing to do with the facts …
Why would they attack the Turkish Cypriots , with the Turkish invasion fleet , permanently poised to set sail … Just 40 miles away ..???
So the republic of Cyprus survived , it’s first Turkish provoked crisis …
And it survives still …
Despite the Turkish deep states , declared policy of using the hapless Turkish Cypriot minority … To destroy the republic of Cyprus …
The next crisis occurred in 1967 … When the legitimate government of Greece was replaced by the illegal NATO backed military junta … These buffoons decided to flex their muscles in Cyprus , by threatening makarios to declare unilateral enosis … So as to provoke a Turkish invasion and they could split the island between them …
Of course as a Cypriot patriot makarios categorically refused , saying openly , that as long as turkey objected … ENOSIS was not possible , and calling for russian support in the case of a NATO attempt to split Cyprus in two , by force of arms …
as Makarios would not play ball , and facilitate a Turkish invasion ..by declaring ENOSIS ..
turkey now chooses this very moment to play its hand again ….They get their TMT cohorts to fire on a government police vehicle , crossing the small bridge passing through the turkish Cypriot half of the village of agios theodoros… A route they had used for years …
The next day turkish Cypriot forces under the command of a Turkish army colonel … Decided to close the main road from larnaca to Nicosia …at the Turkish Cypriot village of KOFINO …
The next day General grivas in command of the Greek Cypriot national guard (but actually working for the Athens junta ) without any orders from the Cyprus government …
Engages the Turkish Cypriot forces on the closed road at kofino … 28 Turkish Cypriot and 9 Greek Cypriot fighters tragically lose their lives …
But the damage is done … And Again the Turkish fleet sets sail …
It’s obvious to all Greeks .. That the Athens junta , and denktash and his Turkish government friends , care nothing for the turkish or greek Cypriot casualties or people … All they care about is to carve up the country … Just like so much real-estate …
Again the Turkish invasion is stopped by the Americans , because of the soviet threat to intervene .,, and a good job too , as we know how much death and destruction that would bring …
Just because the Turkush press was screaming Massacre … Doesn’t mean it was true …
Then again during the july 1974 turkish invasion of cyprus … No Turkish Cypriot civilian casualties …
And similarly during the second unprovoked Turkish offensive no turkush civilian casualties … Except 135 lives lost at MARATHA at the hands of paramilitaries
Whilst 35,000 Turkish civilians were protected by the Greek Cypriot national guard … In The middle of a full scale Turkish attack !!!
5000 Greek Cypriots were killed by the Turkish army … Most murdered in cold blood …
So you see my friend for you to speak of things you know nothing about , is not only inaccurate …
but also highly offensive …

Harris Samaras

Mr. Emre,

Your history lesson cannot convince anyone sane. It is “Made in Turkey”. And your argument starts from the point of history that suits you. And even then fails.

When Greece, Great Britain (at the time), Italy and France liberated the cities that you mentioned why did they do so? Also, was that Ottoman land or was it conquered land? Who were the inhabitants of those cities? And where are they now?

In regard to the Armenians, the Kurds and the Syrians but also the Jews, the Laz, the Alevis, the Caferis and the Rum (and there are more) I only repeat what you stated: SHAME!

Yes in every action there is a reaction, people have to fight for their freedom, and yes there have been some atrocities by the Greeks against the Turks not during the liberation struggle against colonial rule, but post-independence and I highlight “some” – but no comparison to the barbaric atrocities that the Turks have done. If you read the reports of the UN and even Great Britain of the time you will easily realize that. And if you want I can provide them for you. EOKA never targeted children nor women – leave the Turkish propaganda for the Turks so they will be easier to be managed by polarization and fanaticism. Somehow during and after the independence of Cyprus Turkish Cypriots (18% of the total population and most of them imported by the British during colonial rule – their usual divide and conquer approach) had a well equipped army of 18,000 soldiers (bigger than the regular and almost non-existent army of the Republic) while they were citizens of the Republic of Cyprus and privileged ones. This proves only one thing: The expansionist policy of Ankara and its main objective to conquer Cyprus!

Thank you for your wishes for my family.

Turkey has no rights in Cyprus and the Turkish-Cypriots (not the thousands deliberately imported from mainland Turkey) rights are better protected by Cyprus than Turkey: Turkish-Cypriots in the thousands on a number of occasions demonstrated in the streets calling for Turkey to stop oppressing them…

“Aegean 50/50?” Turkey signed only a few treaties. The Treaty of Lausanne is one of them. You should read it. And if it is not yet clear to you realize that the world of the time was appalled with the almost five centuries of darkness that the Ottoman barbaric rule brought upon it. Anyhow, the islands of the Aegean for thousands of years had been Greek even though the Ottomans and later on the Turks tried with massacres (ethnic cleansing) and change of town and village names, by forbidding schooling and practicing own religion (change of sociological character)… to make them look Turkish… but the wolf will always remain a wolf even if it masquerades itself as sheep! This barbaric policy of Turkey continues till today and if you will attempt to doubt it simply read the thousands of human rights reports that call for Turkey to behave in a civilized manner! And this was not then, it was not a century ago it is now! Again, if you don’t have access to these reports, I can forward them to you as well.

Your rationale about the hydrocarbons and the solution to the Cyprus problem is oversimplified and to the benefit of the conqueror which is Turkey not the victim which are the Cypriots both Greeks and Turks. Cypriots (Greeks and Turks) are not any more subjects of the Ottoman Empire, they are free people, with a point of view, expressing themselves within the context of international law; something as you clearly stated Turkey does not want to abide to. We are proud members of the European Union which promotes (and its part of its mission) the respect for human rights and the social market economy!

“The gas must pass through Turkey?” No comments really, but do you really believe that the EU or any truly democratic country can trust Turkey? Think about it.

“War…shoot down an Israeli jet…” I hope not! Such war will be a disaster for everybody! And it will also probably be the end of Turkey as we know it today!

We need to think! Think and act within international law! Any action not abiding to international law will be a disaster and will only prove that we are idiots playing with fire in a gunpowder room… Are we idiots Mr. Emre?

Kdragases

Mr. Samaras,
An intelligent,well written reply!

I have read many of Emre’s comments in the past and concluded that he basically means well. However, at times I feel that on certain issues a debate with him is like trying to explain color to a blind man.

Eric R.

Emre should understand that Turkey is a pretty big country – 85 million people. Nobody is looking to destroy Turkey (although if Israel is facing a second Holocaust, she might nuke it in retaliation, but if Israel is left alone, Turkey would have nothing to worry about).

Emre needs to understand that even under the best of circumstances, Greece is still a country of only 11 million people, and will always be on the defensive when it comes to Turkey.

As for Cyprus, well — 1 million Greek Cypriots are probably scared s**tless that the rest of their Island could fall under Turkish domination; they are not in a position to defeat the Turkish army already on the island.

In other words, Emre (and the rest of Turkey) need to stop seeing their neighbors playing defense as some kind of offense.

Makos

Emre sorry for intervening your discussion with Mr.Samaras but I would also like to present some other aspects here.

First of all there is the geopolitical factor. Countries rarely function through emotion. Interests are at stake always. Turkey invaded Cyprus not to defend the Turkish minority. That was just the excuse. Turkey invaded because it wanted to control the whole island and exert power in the East Med.

“Thus, according to Güneş, Turkey “aims to control the whole of Cyprus.” This intention is not directly related to the existence of Turkish Cypriots, but relates to the broader interests of Turkey in the Eastern Mediterranean. Besides, Davutoglu, in our days in his book, provocatively states that “if there were no Turks in Cyprus” Turkey’s policy towards Cyprus would be the same because its interests as a leading power in this wider geo-strategic location are at stake. To further substantiate his claim he also states that the same happens with the islands in the Aegean “that Greece occupies”, such as the Dodecanese, which, although not many Turks live there today, Turkey shows (or should show) an interest similar to Cyprus. Based on the above the goal of Turkey is the control of the Republic of Cyprus, namely its transformation into a miserable puppet of Ankara. ”
http://www.defencegreece.com/index.php/2011/11/achilles-heel-of-turks-on-the-cyprus-issue/

Turkey would never invaded the island unless it was authorized to do so by the US. Turkey would probably limit its disproportionate reaction in eliminating the Greek minority in Turkey (the pogroms in Constantinople, Imvros and Tenedos). But the US at that time, in the heat of the cold war, were afraid that Cyprus would turn into a new Cuba in the Med. Bear in mind that for as far as the US strategy is concerned the Med is not just another sea. It is rather considered a international ‘corridor’ that gives them access to the heart of Eurasia and N.Africa. Communism had to be stopped from moving there and at those times where intercontinental missiles did not exist, or they had just appeared, the only way to threat the western populous and industrial part of the USSR from the south was with nuclear submarines in the East Med. Control of the Cyprus from the West was no1 strategic goal. Thus Kissinger authorized the invasion. But he did not authorize the subsequent illegal regime in the north. The deal was to move in, remove the ‘threat’ and move out as the Zurich – London agreements could justify. Turkey did not abide to that because it had other plans. The US were ok seeing the island remaining in their control anyway, but they did not want to jeopardize a war between Greece and Turkey. So they did not pressure enough Turkey to leave the island but they did condemn the illegal regime and supported such actions in the UN.

In general, the troubles that Turks and Greeks suffered as well as other nations that formed the Ottoman empire were the result of the dissolution of an empire, actually of an area that had imperial rule with no distinct national borders long before Ottomans appeared. That coupled with the rise of nationalism, the need for freedom and emancipation of the enslaved nations and the corruption and backwardness of the Ottoman system led to an inescapable mess. The same thing happened elsewhere as well, our region is not unique in that regard.

But all of that is past now. We can make a choice here. Continue leaving in the past and reproduce hatred risking more wars and destruction or move on and understand that we can gain more through cooperation. However in order to do that we must agree on the terms of the cooperation. Nationalism and the law of the jungle has proved to be disastrous to the world. It is not an option. International law has proved to work very well in many cases with the most notable paradigm of the EU.

Greece having the bloody experience of WWII, as well as the most part of the rest of the developed world, understood that nationalism is an extremely dangerous thing and moved on. Turkey apparently not, as it is stuck in the anachronistic ideology of Ataturk, a Turkish copy of Bizmark’s ideas. I understand that AKP is trying to change that (whether this change is towards a more modern direction or a more anachronistic one remains a question) but nowhere the sole event of the rise of a political party to power managed to destroy the established ideology of all formal and less formal institutions of a country, unless the people fully supported it. It is a difficult and lengthy process in any case, while nationalism has found a new ally in the form of the Kurdish separatism.

My hope is that Turkey will finally manage to adopt a more modern ideology and that this shift will more likely come from the economic growth and the expansion of the middle class in the developed areas of the country. I hope that this class having more contact with the west because of the international character of the modern economy will form the social nucleus that will drive these changes. Then and only then we will be able to move on our relations in the form that long historic rivals like Germany and France did…

Eric R.

By the way, the Turkish leadership is now so paranoid about Israel, they think even birds are Zionist spies:

http://www.jpost.com/MiddleEast/Article.aspx?id=270715

I’m telling you folks, when it comes to the Islamic world, you just can’t make this stuff up. Whatever you dream up, they will believe something even crazier.
Kdragases

Somehow I sincerely doubt that the Israeli planes were chased out. Far more likely that they left when they were good and ready. Seems like another heroic feat of the Turkish armed forces, similar to the Cyprus invasion, when against all odds, facing an overwhelming foe, they prevailed…
(The sarcasm is totally intentional by the way!)

Eric R.

Turkey is still living in the past – they are still living their victory at Gallipoli; just the way the French, who haven’t won a military victory in over 200 years, still think they are in the Napoleonic Era.
Tyroneez

@kdragases above
Of course Your correct …
From now on The Israeli warplanes … Will come and go … over turkish occupied Cyprus … With impunity , as and when they please …
It should be obvious to everyone , that there has been a fundamental shift , in the power play of this region …
Cyprus is now , for all intents and purposes , an Israeli protectorate …
It seems that mr erdogans I’ll advised navel and airforce bombardment , of the seas around the Israeli gas rigs , was the final straw …
Forcing the Israelis to show him who is boss in this , (their own EEZ ) …
It is now clearly transparent , that turkeys 40 year control of northern Cyprus , was by courtesy of ISRAELI/USA indulgance … And nothing more …
Turkeys military might has been shown to be only a paper tiger … With a miaow instead of the expected roar …
Well mr erdogan , has only himself to blame …
Throwing the baby out with the bathwater , is not a very skillfull diplomatic move …
Responsible governments , seek to limit any diplomatic damage !!!
But (since the mavi marmarra fiasco) he has flung himself headlong into a disastrous downward spiral of monumental blunders …. That I am at a loss to understand …
Can turkey ever recover it’s position from such a debacle … I seriously doubt it ???
If he pushes the Israelis any further … He will find a MOSSAD/INSPIRED massive full-scale Kurdish insurgency bursting on his unfirtunate citizens heads …
And it’s only thanks to Azerbaijan’s prudent cultivation of Israeli interests … That has so far prevented … The obvious Armenian/Israeli alliance , against turkey …
Maybe messrs erdogan and daoutoglou … Failed to attend the diplomacy classes … When they were studying for their political careers …???
I don’t understand it , don’t they study diplomacy in Tutkey ???
Perhaps this is the reason ???
Fisty-cuffs and bullying in the playground , just won’t cut it , he needs to try , anger management classes !!!
Poor turkey … What a predicament !!

Simplesimon

Greeks have been living in what is now Turkey continuously since the middle 2nd millennium BC. It was heavily settled by Ionian and Aeolian Greeks and became known as Ionia and Aeolia. The city of Byzantium, which would go on to become Constantinople and Istanbul, was founded by colonists from Megara of mainland Greece. The Turkish Republic came to be in 1922. Turkey should be grateful that the powers of the time (France and England) did not include the Turkish coast as well as the islands which were always Greek. People need to brush up on history before posting ignorant and provocative statements. My Grandparents came from Smyrna where they had lived peacefully for 2000 years with their Turkish neighbours. During the exchange of populations many Greeks and Turkish people lost everything and had to start again. We should leave the past behind and hope that the Turkish and Greek people can live as friends and neighbours in a peaceful existence.

Tyroneez

@simplesimon above
Amen to that my friend …
from your mouth to gods ear …
Inshallah !!
Dude

Thast funny. France and Britain did try that. In fact they armed Greece heavily.They even ignored the ethnic cleansings you commited but you still lost even though you had more men weapons allies etc.

FredNordblo

You’re funny. Pretending that you know what happened. True, Britain backed the Greeks as they were fighting a proxy war for Britain against the Kemalists. Greece was then stabbed in the back by its erstwhile allies, Italy and France, who concluded secret negotiations with Kemal and then continued to arm the Turks against the Greeks. And while atrocities were committed on both sides, the perfect definition of ethnic cleansing can be summarized by the massacre at Smyrna by the Turkish army on the Christian population of Smyrna after the Turkish military was in control of the city and more than a few days after the Greek army had retreated.

makos

Exactly my friend. Some people are either ignorant or prefer to distort history to their own liking However history is science, a social science but still a science. It’s not about opinion but about recording events through double-checked sources, scrutiny and reason. And history has recorded that nationalists Turks were heavily supported by both Germans and Soviets and on the background by a Greek ‘ally’ Italy. On the other hand Greece was initially supported by the Brits but later they made a 180′ turn and refused us even a small loan to buy food for our troops. As for the Greek army it was in no way larger than Kemal’s. During the first battles yes it was, but soon later Turkish soldiers were amassing from all over Asia Minor, forming new regiments and getting armed by the very best equipment from Germany and Russia. Greece was left alone. As for the massacres it is a joke. Modern Turkey tries to rewrite history by comparing the few isolated incidents of Greek atrocities with the mass scale official plan of the Turks to turkify all Asia Minor, that it is to genocide and expel all Christians The very reason that the Greek campaign was started in the first place. To protect our brothers from the barbarians.

Simplesimon

Having just conquered İstanbul from the Greeks, victorious Ottoman Sultan Mehmed II marched into the Aya Sofya and promised a a world of Muslim-Christian coexistence, to be managed by the Turks. Prior to this conquest it was a world of Christians managed by the Byzantiums. The movie 300 portrayed King Leonidas of Sparta and the Greeks conquering the Persians. In this instance it was theWest victorious over the East. Putting things into perspective, there will always be this struggle between the Muslim and the Christian world. How we manage this world is what matters.

Tyroneez

@simplesimon above
Not quite accurate my friend …
The medieval Greek empire , today (erroneosly called byzantium ) was treacherously attacked by the western Christian franks of the 4th crusade … In 1204 AD ..
They captured Constantinople , and looted murdered and pillaged the greatest and richest city in the world … Partitioned the Greek mainland amongst themselves and Venice grabbed the islands …
Impossd a Latin emperor in Constantinople and a Latin patriach in agia Sophia …
Banned orthodox christanity as a heresy , and exploited the regions wealth for the benefit of Venice and western Europe …
Prior to Columbus … All western imports came via Constantinople ..
Spices , sugar , olives , oil , fruits , wines , currents , silks , manufactured goods …every conceivable luxury ..
The most expensive CARAB PODS , (grown in cyprus and crete) the equivalent of today’s cocoa beans (chocolate) … Worth it’s weight in gold …
They even used carob beans to weigh diamonds … (hence the word diamond carat weight)
The lands produced the equivalent wealth of todays gulf oil states …
Cyprus had the GDP of todays Dubai …
Once the franks and venetian took control , all the wealth went directly to Venice … By passing constantinople completely
Making venice the richest and most powerfull european state for 500 years … All built on the back of Greek labour and wealth
All this wealth paying for the massive venitians fleets … That previously had belonged to Constantinople …
By 1204 a dynasty arose in (latin free) Greek bythinia the Lascaris/paleologue , who managed to retake the now impoverished capital Constantinople …in 1261 AD
But stripped of it’s trade and wealth producing islands and provinces … It struggled for 200 years , against the continued western attacks … And it could not dislodge thd west from it’s former territories ..
Having to fight on 4 fronts …
The Turks
The franks
The Serbs
The Bulgarians
Unable to resist all the above at the same time .. It was powerless to prevent a small band of ottoman turks
Who were able to
Establish themselves as overlords in the middle of the Greek populated heartland of bythinia ..
Their recognition of the orthodox church , was successful in stirring up , the Greek orthodox populations , under the harsher Frankish rule ..
The ottoman success against the franks and Slavs in the Balkans , was directly due to the support of the Greek orthodox church and population …
After the fall of the capital and mehmets confirmation of the orthodox patriach and church … The Greek populations under Frankish and Venetian rule … Welcomed the ottoman conquest …and the orthodox patriachs protection …
Mehmet and all following sultans in recognition of their vulnerability as a tiny minority had no choice but to co-op thd Greeks in their struggles with the western powers …
Because the ottoman state was a duel Moslem , orthodox entity …thd Greeks supported it …as the lesser evil …
The ottoman dynasty itself genetically and culturally mostly Greek (convert) …
Was just the latest dynasty to come out of Greek bythinia …
It managed to achieve , what the paleologue dynasty failed … Complete military superiority over the west …
Primarily due to it’s Christian slave STANDING Army (the jannissary’s) .. So you see , it was not Turkish troops , but Greek troops that conquered firstly the Balkans and then Anatolia and finally thd Arab middle east and north Africa …
It was in fact a revived Greek Byzantine empire .. Under a Greek Moslem dynasty … With a thin Turkish veneer …
But it didn’t matter , so long as the hated western franks were finally swept aside after 300 years of misrule …and exploitation ..
So long as the majority Greek orthodox population was content , the arrangement worked well …
But as time went on , and more and more people converted to islam , the pressure on the remaining Christians , who had to bear most of the empires costs … Became an unbearable burden … Any resistance or objections , were met with massacre and terror … Inevitable when a minority is trying to control a reluctant majority …
The hardships of being a second glass citizen in your own land , became untenable …
The major explosion came in 1821 … When the Greeks finally rebelled on mass , and the ottoman state was from that moment on doomed …
There was no going back …
The wests intervention prolonged the unjust and unworkable ottoman state … For another 100 years …in an effort to keep the Russians out of the meditteranean and middle east …
IT WAS NOT THE FIRST WESTERN BETRAYAL of the Greek world and it won’t be the last …
When it comes to the crunch , the west always puts money first
It’s a cultural thing …
They are about to Betray Greece again , over money …they can never see the bigger picture … Blinded by MAMON as always ..
Which brings us to today’s situation …
The point of all my lengthy comment …
is to bring attention to the fact that there are three competing , elements in this region …
The moslem
The western
And the orthodox
And Greece as does Yugoslavia , lies on the fault lines of all three
Hence it’s volatile past and present …
So as you see it is not the Turkish element in all this that determines the course of events …
But the Greek ..
Before the rise of Orthdox Russia ..
Thd Greeks had a choice of thd Latin west or the Muslim east …
In the 15th century , the hostile west and the papacy left them no choice , but to take the Moslem option … And with this they rebuilt their mighty empire …
But in the process they were in danger of a gradual religious , cultural and ethnic absorption Into a turkish ethnicity …
By the 18th century … The reformed liberal west and orthodox Russia , were an example that could no longer be ignored …
Without Greek orthodox support the sultans regime was impossible … The rest is history …
But Never forget , The west can turn on us just as suddenly as the turks , at any moment …
Witness the italian and french betrayal in anatolia 1922 ..
And just 20 years later … mussolinis and hitlers … Treacherous destruction of Greece in the 1940s …putting the country back 100 years …
Then again the Slav (soviet) thrust south in 1945 to 1949
And today’s western vilification , of brave little Greece …
It’s because , although European , the west sees us as somehow different …
Today it’s expressed as the industrious north
And the lazy south …
It used to be the lascivious east and the pious west …
Watch this space !!!

http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=682830223 Callum Jamieson

My grandparents were living in cyprus through the whole thing, entire villages were massacred literally down the road from them. People from their village were being kidnapped and held to ransom, it was so bad that their village had to set up an armed patrol at night to stop the Greek Cypriot paramillitaries from killing them as they slept.

Turkey saved their life and they are forever grateful for this. Every other word that I’ve seen from a GC on this page screams minipulation of facts to make turkey and TC’s out to be evil. Even today TC’s have no problems with GC’s but the GC’s still want the whole island, still believe its all theirs, still say no massacres occured.

Makes me sick.

Tyroneez

@Callum jamieson above
You are contradicting yourself my friend …
Your grandparents lived through the tragic events of 1963 .. Were 650 Turkish Cypriots and 450 Greek Cypriots , lost their lives , in the intercommunal fighting … Which took place , because , the powersharing government brokedown , (primarily because denktash and his extremists , deliberately vetoed everything in parliament for 3 years , with the aim of causing a crisis , and provoking a Turkish invasion , so as to split the country 50/50)
He has boasted about this many times , the fact that his innocent fellow Turkish Cypriots , would suffer the worst , was of no concern for him , he felt it was a sacrifice worth paying , so long as the Turkish invasion comes …
law and order brokedown …the government lost control
And yes you are correct , the innocent Turkish Cypriot villages spread all over the country , were particularly vulnerable …( To illegal paramilitaries )…
The president of Cyprus (Makarios) responsibly called in the UN peacekeeping force , precisely to protect these isolated Turkish Cypriot enclaves .. And bring the much needed law and order …
And the situation was stabilised , pending a negotiated settlement …
For you to try and pretend that the Greek Cypriots , just suddenly started attacking the Turkish Cypriots is completely dishonourable … And a distortion of the facts ….
The Greek Cypriots had nothing to gain and everything to lose , by such an action …
The breakdown of the government (law and order) … was entirely due to the Turkish Cypriot leadership (on the orders of turkey) deliberately sabotaging all the functions of government …
After the police and security forces split .. Total Chaos ensued
By your own ADMITTANCE The atrocities were caused at the hands of illegal paramillitaries …and not by a general order of the government …
Unlike the genocidal atrocities committed on a massive scale , murdering millions of unarmed civilians , by orders of Turkish Governments … Time and time again … Wether it be in anatolia 1895 , 1914 to 1924 … Or Cyprus 1974 …
For you to pretend to not see the difference , is completely absurd …
Ask your grandparents again , who really caused the cyorys crisis in 1963 and for what motives ???
Ask them also if Turkish Cypriots were targeted , by the cypriot government forces , prior to or during the Turkish invasion of 1974 …
And come back and tell me were and when ???
Long after the invasion in july 1974 … And during the second turkish offensive of august 1974 …135 innocent turkish Cypriots lost their lives at (Maratha/aloa/sandalaris) and 68 Turkish Cypriots at (tokhni) …again at the hands of illegal (under military age) greek cypriot criminal paramilitary killers ..
And we as Greek Cypriots mourn these Turkish Cypriot losses , to this day …
Contrast that to what was being done by the OFFICIAL Turkish army in the north … Were 5000 Greek Cypriots , mostly unarmed civillians were killed ??
And were you contradict yourself the most … Is were you state , that punishing today’s generation for the misdeeds of the past is not justified !!!
Yet you insist on illegally partitioning Cyprus and trampling on the legitimate rights of 82% of Cypriots …
Because of , paramilitary excesses of the 1960s
If you are honestly proposing that paramilitaries would have any ability to cause trouble in the Cyprus of today …
Then again you are being dishonest and are just persueing your hidden agenda …
There is absolutely no justification (ON SECURITY GROUNDS) for the Illegal Turkish occupation of 40% of the best parts of Cyprus …
It’s obvious to everyone , that it’s just a shameful land-grab primarily aimed at the eventual , expulsion of the 82% Greek cypriot majority , from cyprus …
And on top of that you criticise us for resisting , by all means possible … Diplomatic , Legal and economic (not military) …
Trying to twist everything , to justify the unjustifiable ..
Shame on you

Makos

You also forgot about the pogrom and the extermination of the Greek minority in Turkey. The ones that were excluded from the exchange of population after the Lausane Treaty and that now surprisingly almost none of them is left, after the orders of the Turkish government.

Makos

The propagandized ‘massacres’ of Turks in Cyprus was the perfect excuse for the Turkish government to organize and mobilize the nationalist mob so that they perpetrate any possible crime against the unprotected Greek minority in Turkey, murder, rape, beating, loot, confiscation of property and forceful removal of their citizenship. So convenient to get both Cyprus and the extermination of the Greek minority in Constantinople…As for the minority in Imvros and Tenedos other methods were employed that led to the same result…

Solinariforever

Collum,

Great!
Let the TC have a free vote on the issue – minus the 200K Turkish settlers!
Your argument is one-sided. You are arguing as if your hypothetical victim was Turkey – If it makes you sick get an aspirin.

http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=682830223 Callum Jamieson

Also I see comments about Turkey’s history, which explain how disgraceful turkey was in the past. To that I say…..SO WHAT.

That isn’t a justification for what happened in Cyprus so stop making out like my grandparents friends deserved to be murdered by GC’s because of things that happened 100′s of years ago. I don’t need to see reports either, for all I know they are propaganda, my grandparents bear firsthand witness and know EXACTLY what happened, how it started and who started it.

Makos

I do not like to repeat myself, but you can read the rest of the comments here and you will learn many things that will help you understand what happened then. At least one other point of view and usually an educated one, as those participating here have both knowledge of the past and reasoning. That might be a good start besides residing solely on an isolated experience or even worst on the official Turkish propaganda.

Solinariforever

Emre
Your account of the past is so shortsighted and biased in making a point that it actually sounds like a S. African Vuvuzela. It is trumped by actual historical facts if you can only listen to the world! Imagine the resistance of the Jewish in Poland and elsewhere just prior to WWii in Europe and you know the resistance of the minorities in Turkey in the past and current centuries. Well, it has gotten a bit better – no pogroms in the last ten years and no buses of visitors burned just for sheer meanness and hate!

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